Clay Hinderliter; Town and gown divide?
ed komenda
Issue date: 10/21/09 Section: News
From this point on, if there's a problem, the police are going to come. I got a busted eye socket once. I'm not going to do that again. Dealing with sober students is different than dealing with drunk students. And generally when you're dealing with drunk students, you're dealing with a group of drunk students. And I had to call the police that night, because their music was too loud, and their screaming was too loud, and their conversation was too loud, and I was a half a block away. I have a 30 percent hearing loss, I've been shot at in 10 countries, I've been hit in four. When you get me out of bed at night because of noise at a party, you've really broke the threshold.
I'm not a big drinker. I never have been. And I don't judge anybody who is a drinker, but I'll flat tell you, I hate drunks. They're not as smart as they think they are. They're not as glib as they think they are. They're not as cool as they think they are. And they have little to no experience.
And that's not a town and gown divide. That's a problem that needs to be addressed on multiple levels.
Solutions?
I have suggested to the university that the city needs to be involved in this solution. The university needs to be involved in the solution. The alcohol venders need to be involved in the solution. And probably the landlords, as a group, need to be involved in that solution.
I have one opinion - mine. Currently bars are allowed to have people age 20 in there. If I were king for a day, it'd be 21. And the reality of it is I had my 21st birthday in a place called Vietnam. I wasn't legal to drink, but I was legal to kill somebody.
My solution - bars will close at midnight, particularly on school nights, Monday through Thursday. Only 21-year-olds. I think there will probably be more penalties for alcohol establishments that weren't vigilant in making sure alcohol didn't get into the hands of underage people. And the other thing, I'll flat tell you, is that the parties that occur wouldn't happen. It flat wouldn't happen. If I were king for a day and I went to a house if they were having a kegger, and I found half a dozen people who were underage that they were selling alcohol. Conduct, unbecoming. Contributing to the delinquency of a minor. How far do you want to go? 'Well, I'm just giving the beer.' No, not really. We can sit here and philosophize about our differences in opinion on alcohol for young folks all you want, but the law's the law. And there are good laws and there are bad laws, and if they're bad laws, you change them through the process; you don't overtly break them and say, 'It's my right.' Well, you can break them. Be prepared to pay the consequences too.
Why the misconduct?
Society. I look at television. I'm amazed. This reality TV programming is unreal. I mean, you're being voyeurs. You watching somebody else make a fool of themselves. And it's funny for your viewing entertainment? Another aspect of it is that everything is in your face these days. I think people have confused two terms that are diametrically opposed - outstanding, standing out. Outstanding means without peers or few peers in your field or in your endeavor or whatever you're doing. Standing out means look at me, look at me, look at me for 15 minutes of fame. They are not the same thing.
If you want to call me an old fart, call me an old fart, but if you're going to judge me like that, you better have walked a mile in my shoes.
I'm not a big drinker. I never have been. And I don't judge anybody who is a drinker, but I'll flat tell you, I hate drunks. They're not as smart as they think they are. They're not as glib as they think they are. They're not as cool as they think they are. And they have little to no experience.
And that's not a town and gown divide. That's a problem that needs to be addressed on multiple levels.
Solutions?
I have suggested to the university that the city needs to be involved in this solution. The university needs to be involved in the solution. The alcohol venders need to be involved in the solution. And probably the landlords, as a group, need to be involved in that solution.
I have one opinion - mine. Currently bars are allowed to have people age 20 in there. If I were king for a day, it'd be 21. And the reality of it is I had my 21st birthday in a place called Vietnam. I wasn't legal to drink, but I was legal to kill somebody.
My solution - bars will close at midnight, particularly on school nights, Monday through Thursday. Only 21-year-olds. I think there will probably be more penalties for alcohol establishments that weren't vigilant in making sure alcohol didn't get into the hands of underage people. And the other thing, I'll flat tell you, is that the parties that occur wouldn't happen. It flat wouldn't happen. If I were king for a day and I went to a house if they were having a kegger, and I found half a dozen people who were underage that they were selling alcohol. Conduct, unbecoming. Contributing to the delinquency of a minor. How far do you want to go? 'Well, I'm just giving the beer.' No, not really. We can sit here and philosophize about our differences in opinion on alcohol for young folks all you want, but the law's the law. And there are good laws and there are bad laws, and if they're bad laws, you change them through the process; you don't overtly break them and say, 'It's my right.' Well, you can break them. Be prepared to pay the consequences too.
Why the misconduct?
Society. I look at television. I'm amazed. This reality TV programming is unreal. I mean, you're being voyeurs. You watching somebody else make a fool of themselves. And it's funny for your viewing entertainment? Another aspect of it is that everything is in your face these days. I think people have confused two terms that are diametrically opposed - outstanding, standing out. Outstanding means without peers or few peers in your field or in your endeavor or whatever you're doing. Standing out means look at me, look at me, look at me for 15 minutes of fame. They are not the same thing.
If you want to call me an old fart, call me an old fart, but if you're going to judge me like that, you better have walked a mile in my shoes.
Viewing Comments 1 - 10 of 22
Dave Huber
posted 10/21/09 @ 1:18 PM CST
The town wouldn't exist if not for the university so shut up and put up old man. You aren't king you're a hillbilly living in a college town so get over it or move out. (Continued…)
Michelle Olson
posted 10/21/09 @ 3:35 PM CST
This is not only a Macomb issue, but a National issue. Somewhere along the line we have have lost our moral compass as well as teaching our youth respect and boundaries. (Continued…)
Macomb Resident Since 1967
posted 10/21/09 @ 3:50 PM CST
I have lived in Macomb since 1967. So I have been around this town for 42 years. I am a graduate of WESTERN. GOOOO Leathernecks!!
Clay Hinderliter does not speak for me. (Continued…)
Lindsey Vehlewald
posted 10/21/09 @ 4:02 PM CST
Just because you do not agree with someone's solution to an obvious problem is no reason to attack the person himself. If you were to bother to think logically, you would see some merit of Mr. (Continued…)
Dave Dorsett
posted 10/21/09 @ 10:15 PM CST
This town did exist and would continue to exist, albet in a much different form, without the university. That being said, there is no reason to believe we'll need to find out either way for some time. (Continued…)
Melissa
posted 10/22/09 @ 12:11 AM CST
If the worst offenses are by a small % of students, I think strict enforcement & penalties are a good approach for both the student & resident populations. (Continued…)
Anonymous
posted 10/22/09 @ 1:29 PM CST
I think, besides the bars, the first interaction that students have with residents is their landlords. This can be very frustrating when your landlord, no matter how well you take care of the house, won't help you when something goes wrong or it takes over a week, or in many cases longer than that to fix anything. (Continued…)
AJD
posted 10/22/09 @ 1:43 PM CST
The last poster has hit on something I've been talking about for awhile. This city needs some sort of "board" to deal with relations between landlords and tenants or to deal with complaints about particular student tenants in the neighborhoods. (Continued…)
Dave Dorsett
posted 10/22/09 @ 6:36 PM CST
While I agree there is a need for bringing landlords into the equation, that's far easier said than done. As it is there is supposed to be a yearly meeting between the city, the Student Tenant Union (STU) and representatives of the Macomb Landlord's Association (MLA) to address amny of these issues. (Continued…)
Dave Dorsett
posted 10/23/09 @ 11:21 AM CST
Just for the record, a question is not technically a rebuttal.
Personal observation over more years than I care to address and the opinions of the city's Community Development staff as well as local police AND some landlords. (Continued…)
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